Hunter Stat Conversions
Ratings at level 110 in Legion
1 Agility = 1 Attack Power400 Crit Rating = 1% Chance to Critically Strike375 Haste Rating = 1% Increased Haste475 Versatility Rating = 1% Increased Damage950 Versatility Rating = 1% Decreased Damage Taken
Weapon Damage Normalization:BM and MM: WD + 2.8*AP/3.5SV: WD + 3.3*AP/3.5
Global Cooldown = 1.5 second (.75 second minimum cap)
Focus RegenBase Regen = 10 focus per secondFocus Regen per Second with X% Haste = 10*(1+X/100)
Cast-times with Haste EffectsCast-time with X% Haste = CT/(1+X/100)Cast-time with Trueshot = CT/((1+X/100)*(1.4))Cast-time with Ancient Hysteria = CT/((1+X/100)*(1.3))Cast-time with TS & AH = CT/((1+X/100)*(1.4)*(1.3))Mastery by Spec
MM - Sniper TrainingBase Mastery = 20% increased damage of all focus-spending abilities.Base Mastery = 5% increased range.160 Mastery Rating = +1% increased damage for focus-spending abilities.640 Mastery Rating = +1% increased range.
SV - Hunting CompanionBase Mastery = 4% chance to grant an additional charge of Mongoose Bite.800 Mastery Rating = +1% increased chance for charge of Mongoose Bite.
BM - Master of BeastsBase Mastery = 18% increased pet damage.177.77 Mastery Rating = +1% increased pet damage.
Hunter Pet Stat Conversions at level 110 in Legion
Pets Gain:
60% of hunter AP
70% of hunter Stamina
170% of hunter Armor
100% of hunter Haste + 10% Attack Speed
100% of hunter Crit + 10% Crit
0% of hunter increased Crit Damage
100% of hunter Versatility
125% of hunter focus regen
Hati Gains:
96% of hunter AP
70% of hunter Stamina
125% of hunter Armor
100% of hunter Haste
100% of hunter Crit
0% of hunter increased Crit Damage
100% of hunter Versatility
Dire Beasts Gain:
140% of hunter AP
20% of hunter Stamina
125% of hunter Armor
100% of hunter Haste
100% of hunter Crit
0% of hunter increased Crit Damage
100% of hunter Versatility
Hunter Ability Formulas
Marks:
Unlisted MM Buffs: 12% to Aimed, Arcane, Barrage, Black Arrow, Bursting, Marked, Multi, aMoC, Piercing, Sidewinders, Volley, and Windburst.
Beast Mastery:
Unlisted BM Buffs: 14.5% to Chimaera, Barrage, Stomp, Multi, Cobra, Stampede, Surge of the Stormgod, Volley, and a Murder of Crows. 14.5% to all pet damage. 50% to Volley. 100% to Barrage.
Survival:
Unlisted SV Buffs: 12% to all pet and hunter damage.
Notes:
- In-game tooltips are not always changed when hotfixes are applied, so they will often show different amounts from what you'll do. Because websites like wowhead and wowdb use the in-game client information to build their sites, they will also often show outdated information. I'll be attempting to keep this list updated every time there is a hotfix, though if anyone sees one I missed, feel free to leave a note in the comments below, and I'll get them updated.
- "ADR" stands for Armor Damage Reduction, and as such, these abilities will have their damage reduced by the target's armor (.6802 modifier when calculating damage done by a level 110 player against a level 113 raid boss, see below for the Legion Armor Table).
- "H CD" stands for "Hasted Cooldown". Abilities checked in this column have lower CDs with higher haste values. Calculate the same as cast times; e.g. Kill Command has a base CD of 7.5 seconds, I have 20% haste, the CD of Kill Command will be 7.5/(1+.2) = 5.83 seconds.
- "Mast." stands for mastery. This column denotes which abilities are affected by the spec's mastery.
- For BM hunters, no abilities "double dip" in mastery. Beast Cleave and Jaws of Thunder, for example, both benefit from mastery in that the original ability their damage is based off of benefits from mastery, but they do not get a second mastery bonus in addition. Similarly, these abilities cannot crit; if the original ability the damage is inherited from is a crit, then these abilities base their damage off the original crit damage, but do not "double dip".
- "WD" stands for Weapon Damage. Calculate using either the average from your weapon's tooltip, or use min. and max. in your calculations for the entire range (which is cumbersome, but helps avoid rounding errors when investigating hotfixes).
- "AP" stands for attack power. All abilities (including pets) are shown based on the Hunter's Attack Power.
- For abilities affected by Artifact Traits, use the percent increase from the artifact as another coefficient. For example, if you have 4/4 ranks in the Pack Leader trait, your Kill Command has 20% increased damage. To calculate this, insert "*1.2" at the end of the formula.
Armor Table:
The Formula for calculating the damage reduction from armor is:
DR% = K / (K+A)
For Legion level creatures, the K and Armor values are:
| Level | Level Constant K | OtherCreature Armor | MageCreature Armor |
| 100 | 3610 | 1536 | 1229 |
| 101 | 3973 | 2313 | 1850 |
| 102 | 4373 | 2388 | 1911 |
| 103 | 4812 | 2467 | 1974 |
| 104 | 5296 | 2550 | 2041 |
| 105 | 5829 | 2638 | 2110 |
| 106 | 6415 | 2729 | 2184 |
| 107 | 6642 | 2826 | 2261 |
| 108 | 6880 | 2927 | 2342 |
| 109 | 7132 | 3035 | 2428 |
| 110 | 7390 | 3144 | 2516 |
| 111 | 7648 | 3254 | 2604 |
| 112 | 7906 | 3364 | 2692 |
| 113 | 8164 | 3474 | 2779 |
The significant numbers from that table for most raiders are a level 110 player hitting a level 113 raid boss. That is:
7390 / (7390 + 3474) = 0.680228
This gives us the physical damage reduction from armor, 68.02%.
Thank you for posting this info, I've been looking for the actual scaling values for AMoC without any luck until this post.
ReplyDeleteI assume this takes into consideration the recent Aimed/Kill Shot nerfs?
Also, how're you finding the secondary stat allocation on Highmaul gear? Are there any pieces you'd recommend using a crafted item instead?
Yes on the Aimed/Kill Shot Nerfs. I'll try to keep updating this as often as we get hotfixes, also. I should probably add a note that that's why the numbers don't match the tooltips.
DeleteI'd only use crafted gear on a hunter if it's a higher ilvl, not for better itemization. Right now it seems agi (and weapon damage) is still so much more important than secondary stats, and the secondary stats aren't that far apart from each other, that ilvl is what's really important. I keep seeing, in the forums, people will say this stat or that stat is garbage, but really they're all pretty similar in value.
For example, my dps gain per stat right now looks like:
Agi = 4.8
MS = 2.2
Crit = 1.93
Vers = 1.83
Haste = 1.81
Mast = 1.57
So even if I'm comparing my a piece with my two worst stats, and a piece with my two best stats, there's never a time where the lower ilvl piece will be worth more, since the difference of the two best and two worst stats is still less than the value of agility.
Of course, if a guild is only doing heroics, and 570 is the best piece you can get until BrF, then it might be worth crafting some triple upgraded items and seeing if you can re-roll the stats enough. But if you're going into mythic at all, then the stats won't matter, you'll just want to equip as much mythic gear as possible.
Maybe this should be a full post instead of a comment.. :-P
Godsdamnit, phone ate my comment.
ReplyDeleteLong story short, I'm skeptical of sims (especially of their weighting with regards to haste), but haven't cracked open a spreadsheet to make some heads of it all due to lack of the formulas you provided.
Part of the reason I'm debating it is I came into some 670 gear with x/haste that'd replace 655 gear with crit/x(not haste) as a focusing shot build.
I'll post back later when I've got a bit more numbers to discuss.
Cool, I look forward to hearing your conclusions.
DeleteI ran several sims last night after I figured out how to get my characters gear into simcraft as my characters armory is currently bugged (apparently pulls fine from the API for AMR/etc).
DeleteNow, my reasoning behind haste being such a terrible secondary stat is that the only thing it would affect is auto shot (~10%) and pet DPS as unless I reach a specific breakpoint my rotation with focusing shot is unchanged.
What I found is that with one exception of a crit/multistrike 636 set of gear versus 640 (which had an incredibly small DPS increase in favour of the 640 piece), I am forced to echo your conclusion that ilevel trumps secondary stats, even with going from two awesome secondaries to one awesome one mediocre but +15 levels.
From what I hear BRF is supposed to offer more variety, but until then the secondary stats are mostly an illusion of choice. Crit will continue to be a choice secondary due to its interaction with aimed shot, but everything else is mostly a wash of different pools of multipliers that increase each other's value.
Well, colour me disappointed.
I recently converted to a hunter and have been enjoying it. I was looking for stat conversions, and this was the first site to list them and also explain the reasoning behind why some stats are better to stack (even if just slightly better). Most of those other "popular" sites don't seem to try and explain their stat priorities. Thank you for all of the info, and I am especially interested in the Hunter Ability Formulas posted above, regarding AP and WD. I am eager to incorporate this into my own spreadsheets.
ReplyDeleteWith regards to the MM stat priority, here is my two cents:
MS > Versatility > Haste > Mastery (if 90% uptime) > Crit
Yeah, going against the grain a bit with this one, and here's why.
Crit vs Multistrike:
The stat weights are very similar at the base level, when all stats are 0%. At this level, Crit and MS are practically identical, but with Marksmanship (MM) getting 5% increase to Crit from all sources, Crit edges ahead.
However, with all of the other bonuses to Crit during the course of a fight, I feel Crit loses in the end due to the multiplicative nature of the stats. While mobs/bosses are >80% health, MM gets Careful Aim which increases crit% by 60%. Usually during the pulls, TimeWarp / Bloodlust gets popped, so add 30% haste to that. Rapid Fire achieves the same effect, by increasing crit% by 60% and haste by 40%. It is during these times that crit actually becomes a WORSE stat, point for point, than most other stats.
It is for this reason that I prefer stacking Multistrike whenever possible over crit. When crit% gets stacked so heavily at certain points in the fight (>80% health, Rapid Fire), adding any other stat in place of crit becomes more beneficial to overall dps. During these "high spike" parts of the fight, both Haste and Crit suffer Diminishing Returns since they are already at such high %'s. MM gets no boost to Multistrike through abilities (only procs from weapon enchant or trinkets), so it becomes a more reliable stat IMO. This reliability also extends to Versatility and somewhat to Mastery.
So while the stats are similarly weighted at the base level, I believe the giant boosts to crit and haste throughout the fight warrant a bigger consideration to the other secondary stats that won't suffer any kind of DR, even if momentarily.
The reason I put Haste > Mastery is because in high movement fights, keeping Sniper Training active could prove difficult. And, when it drops off and you are finally able to stand still again, you have to wait 3 seconds in order for it to go into effect. Also, when Sniper Training is in effect, it increases crit which IMO, I don't like. I do like the extra boost to range, though... I'm up in the air considering Haste vs. Mastery.
So, now that my 2 cents became 10 cents, haha... I believe Multistrike wins in the long run compared to Crit. After that, an even mix of Haste / Mastery / Versatility might be a good way to go.
In retrospect, I didn't say anything about the interaction between Aimed Shot and crit, where crits with Aimed Shot refund 20 Focus. This would definitely put crit a little higher back up on the list, and not dead last >< I am not sure how high though.
DeleteI would have to analyze my shot priority, rotation, how often it is cast, average focus regen, etc. Another item to add to my list of thing to do!
Always one to admit my mistakes, I felt the need to return.
DeleteAnd before reading too much, this is all in regards to Marksmanship.
I created a fight simulator tool in Excel. You can enter agility, weapon damage (min and max), and all of the secondary stats. I assumed 100% uptime of Sniper Training which is generous, I know. It also assumes no weapon enchants or trinket procs, since the simulator is meant to measure stats, not gear.
I also assumed Rapid Fire at the start of the fight with Time Warp, and then the typical priority of abilities. I did not include glaive toss or barrage, only the following spells (Kill Shot, Chimaera Shot, Aimed Shot, Steady Shot, and Auto Shot).
I used my own stats to begin with, in order to verify the accuracy. I assumed full raid buffs, no food buffs or flasks (shrug). Then, I scaled all the stats down... and upped them one by one and ran the simulations. I assumed maximum stat points of 3000, because at that point crit hits 40% (with minimal help from mastery), so it felt like a good round number.
At the press of a button, the simulator would run 10 different fights, get the dps of each fight, and present an average at the end. The whole process takes about 1 second.
The abilities by themselves provided the following results:
Crit > Multistrike > Mastery (100% uptime) > Versatility > Mastery (90% uptime) > Haste
Haste turned out to be horrible, so horrible. I believe this is due to chimaera shot and kill shot being instant cast, and therefore haste really only helps with cast times of aimed shot and steady shot. Aimed shot is cast mostly during bloodlust / rapid fire, where haste already gets a big boost (so more haste has DR), and steady shot is only a filler spell and therefore reducing the cast time of it doesn't really help all that much.
I support Xaeroflex's assessment of Haste, and that it should be avoided.
I tried playing with the stats to see what combination would yield the best dps, and it was all fairly similar as long as I avoided Haste. Crit and Multistrike together had the best results, but not by much.
Anywho...
Merry Christmas!
Cool, that's pretty much what I got, so glad to hear it was verified. It's really unfortunate, 'cause the MM rotation is a lot more fun at high haste levels. If only fun were more directly related to DPS. :-P
DeleteJust a question, I remember back before WoD launched. If you were looking at your stats, beyond the core (AGI, STR, STA, and so on) anything above a certain % was basically wasted, is that still true? And if so what is the top out percentage?
ReplyDeleteThere aren't many "hard caps" for hunters. For survival and BM, Multistrike caps at 100%, and crit at 103%. For Marksmanship hunters there's a soft crit cap at 43%, but there is still some benefit from more crit above that point. Versatility and Mastery can theoretically go as high as possible, though they aren't necessarily the most beneficial stats. And Haste is generally considered capped when you get your cobra or steady shot cast time down to 1 sec (since you can't going any faster than that won't matter, due to the GCD).
DeleteThank you very much, I have been looking for a while and finally had to ask. :)
DeleteHi Delirium- how is this information looking now that patch 6.2.2 is out?
ReplyDelete-roo
Hey roo, I've actually just moved to a new apartment on the first, and don't yet have internet in my new apartment, so I haven't had a chance to play 6.2.2 at all! :-P Hopefully I can get things changed soon, though. i wouldn't trust the stat weights shown here, and I can't recall what changed for hunters off the top of my head.
DeleteHey there could u please tell me exatly whats the Pet Basic Attack melee formula if u still have it!
ReplyDeleteHaving some issues regarding BM pets melee calculator!
1.5*.6*AP*2/3.5 Doesnt fit.. theres a *1.8 missing somewhere in there aparently...
I've been looking primarily at the Legion Beta recently, and I'm having trouble remembering if this is different or not from live. But just to go over it quickly (if I have the right formula in my head)
DeletePet Bites/Claws/Smacks should be
2*.333*AP/3.5
It's this kind of weird thing, as although pets have .6 the hunter's AP, for some reason their basic attacks are based on one third of the hunter AP. IIRC some dev back in the WoD beta said that it was because of something in some very old legacy code that they couldn't change without other repercussions.
Anyhow, from their, you'd tack on
*1.1 [for Spiked Collar]
*1.5 [for combat experience]
*(1+m) [where m is the floating point decimal of BM's mastery]
*.6507 [assuming you're lvl 100, attacking a raid boss/dummy]
*(1+v) (where v is the floating point decimal of your versa]
I don't think I'm missing anything, but I very well may be. Anyhow, hope that's helpful. Let me know if that doesn't work, and I'll dig into it further.
Oh, also, these abilities will be affected by Wild Hunt (if you're new, this is a hidden spell that used to be called wild hunt, you can now find it by a weird name like "pet basic attack focus cost modifier" on wowhead), which doubles the damage done by your pet's Bite/Claw/Smack, and costs double focus, when your pet is above 50 focus.
DeleteSo, when testing on a training dummy, i find it easiest to manually cast the Basic Attack instead of leaving it on autocast, and then only hit it when my pet gets back to full focus, this way I know the modifier is always in place, and I don't have to sort through the data to try to figure out when I need to account for it and when I don't.
This guide is amazing. I really hope you keep it updated.
ReplyDeleteThanks, and I will try.
DeleteI liked your analysis of the shots. According to wowhead, bursting shot is 10 focus, not 50.
ReplyDeleteFrom my testing, Explosive Shot definitely seems to be effected by Mastery
ReplyDeleteYou're definitely right, they added a focus cost in 7.1.5 (or maybe 7.1, i forget), and I never thought to change it here. Thanks!
Delete